bucky

it's kind of long.. but worth reading!!

article published today by Salon, will probably get your blood flowing in anger at how stupid and backwards the american government can be..

http://www.salon.com/ent/music/feat...ture/index.html

Sell a glowstick, go to prison

Authorities are shutting down 21st century raves using 1980s crack-house laws -- and turning pacifiers and Vicks VapoRub into the new drug paraphernalia.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Janelle Brown

June 20, 2001 | Witness the humble glowstick. This neon yellow tube of light, testament to the wonders of the nontoxic chemical reaction, is popular at Britney Spears concerts, Mardi Gras parades and summer street fairs. But because glowsticks are also commonly found at raves, where partiers wave them about during their dance-floor kinetics, they have become a curious casualty of the government's war on drugs.

...........goto website to read the article, its too long to post it all here!

__________________
http://www.wnysor.net
http://www.polishsoup.net
http://www.throatpunching.com

anabolic frolic

Sell a glowstick, go to prison
Authorities are shutting down 21st century raves using 1980s crack-house laws -- and turning pacifiers and Vicks
VapoRub into the new drug paraphernalia.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Janelle Brown

June 20, 2001 | Witness the humble glowstick. This neon yellow tube of light, testament to the wonders of the
nontoxic chemical reaction, is popular at Britney Spears concerts, Mardi Gras parades and summer street fairs. But
because glowsticks are also commonly found at raves, where partiers wave them about during their dance-floor kinetics,
they have become a curious casualty of the government's war on drugs.

An injunction handed down against a group of New Orleans party promoters last Wednesday charges that glowsticks --
along with pacifiers, Vicks VapoRub and dust masks -- are "drug paraphernalia," and their presence on a dance floor is
a sign that illegal drug activity is taking place.

In response, the promoters have banned glowsticks from their clubs, along with chill rooms, where partiers might go to
catch their breath (or where they might, in the eyes of the authorities, go to take their drugs) and massage tables (where God knows what nefarious activities might
occur). The injunction seems to imply that if you take away the chill rooms and the glowsticks, you take away the drugs.

It's bafflingly backward logic, but then again, the federal government's war on drugs hasn't always made sense.

The demonization of the cheery little glowstick is the harbinger of a topsy-turvy new front in that increasingly bizarre conflict. As teens continue to gobble ecstasy,
ketamine, speed and GHB at frightening rates, everything and everyone is vulnerable. While the owners of venues like nightclubs where patrons do illegal acts have
always been subject to crackdowns, grim prosecutors are now targeting dance clubs with leaky old "crack house" laws from the 1980s, and threatening owners and
promoters with decades in prison.

In this new era, even promoters who try to stop drug use are vulnerable. Call the cops on a drug-using patron and you've marked yourself as the owner of a drug
operation. Hire an ambulance as a precaution against overdoses, or let a harm-reduction group like DanceSafe distribute safety literature, and you've done the same
thing.

If the New Orleans case should set a national standard, not only will ravers lose their glowsticks, but the entire dance community could potentially lose its clubs, concert
halls and parties -- and, in the most drastic cases, ravers could lose their lives.

"The government is engaged in an outright war on nightclubs, which they hope will make it appear that they are doing something to stop the drug epidemic," says Will
Patterson, who runs the Electronic Music Defense and Education Fund that raised $50,000 for the Freebass promoters' defense. "But if you take away the clubs, [drug
users] just go somewhere [else]. The nightclubs are, at least, trying to combat drug use in every way they can."

- - - - - - - - - - - -

"Lately raves are just a venue for drug purchases. They are no more than analogous to a crack house, in which you go buy the drugs and go out the back
door. Although there's music being played, and the people at the raves are saying, 'I come here for the music,' drugs are predominant in these rave clubs.
And it's just a mix of drugs and music, and it's become a venue for drug purchases."

-- quote from a promotional video distributed by the DEA

By any measure, the government's war on drugs has been a failure. Despite the fact that the government spent $17.9 billion on the drug war last year -- and arrested
1,532,200 people on drug charges the year before -- the number of young adult drug users has not significantly changed since it hit a peak in 1997, according to the
annual Monitoring the Future study. Fifty-four percent of all high school seniors have done drugs; and the drugs they are doing are harder. According to the National
Institute on Drug Abuse, 8.2 percent of all high school seniors did MDMA, or ecstasy, in 2000 (up from 5.6 percent the year before). Drugs like GHB (a liquid that
more mildly mimics the floaty, euphoric sensation of ecstasy) and ketamine (an animal tranquilizer that, when snorted, sends the user into a hallucinatory state that
nears catatonia), which once were used primarily by New Agers seeking psychedelic epiphanies, are also on the rise among partying young adults and teens.

And the harder the drug, the more dangerous it can be. More than 2,850 people were admitted to hospitals for what were termed "ecstasy overdoses" in 1999,
according to the Drug Abuse Warning Network, or DAWN. And although DAWN reports that the number of deaths from drugs like ketamine, ecstasy and GHB
was relatively small between 1994 and 1998 (12 died from GHB, 47 from ketamine, 27 from ecstasy), those numbers are several years old, and the DanceSafe
organization now cites at least 100 ecstasy-related deaths. The vast majority of these, however, were not overdoses but rather the result of overheating on the dance
floor, or because pills sold as ecstasy were actually dangerous substances like DXM, a cough suppressant that can cause overheating if taken in large quantities, and
the stimulant PMA.

The National Institute on Drug Abuse calls these "club drugs" -- though users, of course, can do them just about anywhere. Accordingly, however, the government
has brought its drug war to the clubs themselves. While state and local authorities have been cracking down on raves and all-night dance clubs for almost a decade
across the country, the national hysteria over teens and ecstasy has brought the battle to a fever pitch. Federal authorities are now stepping in, and the new front lines
are in New Orleans and Panama City Beach, Fla.

When the New Orleans promoters were indicted in January, partiers and promoters across the country sat up and paid attention. Robert Brunet, Brian Brunet and
James ("Donnie") Estopinal were partners in New Orleans' most popular all-night dance party, Freebass, at the State Palace Theater dance club. Every weekend,
Freebass would fly in the world's top DJs to play for thousands of ecstatic dancers -- just like dozens, if not hundreds, of other clubs and parties that take place
across the United States every weekend.

Undercover cops from the Drug Enforcement Administration and the New Orleans Police Department had infiltrated the parties; finding that some attendees were
doing drugs, the U.S. district attorney in New Orleans drew up charges against the promoters. This, in itself, was not unusual -- promoters have skirmished with
authorities for years -- but the law under which the three were eventually indicted offered a frightening new twist. Federal authorities were using a musty,
long-forgotten law from 1986, the "Crack House Statute," which was originally written to attack the proprietors of drug havens for crack cocaine. Although the
Brunets and Estopinal had not personally sold any drugs at their parties, they were charged with "knowingly and intentionally" running a club where people did drugs.

The punishment? A possible 20 years in prison, and potentially millions of dollars in fines.

The ramifications were far-reaching. If the Brunets and Estopinal were found guilty of running a 21st century crack house, then every promoter who threw a club,
party or similar event where attendees were doing drugs could potentially be found similarly liable. And, other than the occasional Amy Grant concert, are there any
music events where you can't find attendees who are doing drugs of some sort? The indictment was a shot fired across the bow of the entire dance music industry.

"The government has this crazy notion that, somehow or another, a promoter should be held criminally responsible as a drug offender because of what people in the
audience may do," said Arthur A. Lemann III, the lawyer who defended Bryan Brunet. "It's a lot like arresting the usher because Pavarotti stabs the fat lady at the
end of the opera."

The New Orleans promoters faced a legal ordeal that could take years. It could cost them millions and still land them in jail. On Wednesday, the three promoters
accepted a plea bargain; their company, Barbecue Inc. (rather than the individuals themselves), would plead guilty to one count of operating a crack house, and the
corporation would pay a $100,000 fine. The promoters would not have to serve any jail time; but the settlement also included an injunction that forbade the presence
of glowsticks, Vicks VapoRub, masks, pacifiers, massage tables and chill rooms at future parties. (Partiers rub the Vicks under their noses for an additional buzz; the
pacifiers are to stop tripping dancers from grinding their teeth or simply as a fashion accessory; dust masks are for fashion, to enhance the effects of the Vicks -- and
sometimes just to keep dance-floor dust out of their system.)

anabolic frolic

Lemann calls the plea bargain a "face-saving masquerade" to hide the fact that the government didn't have a strong case; and the deal was certainly a personal victory
for the promoters, who no longer face spending the rest of their lives in jail. But the fact remains that a company that throws late-night parties and sells glowsticks was
found guilty of running a crack house; and that decision could still spell disaster for the nation's clubs, which could now face similar charges. (Donnie Estopinal did not
accept the plea bargain; and although he has not been personally reindicted, it remains a possibility that he could still go to trial.)

"It is a bad precedent," says University of Tennessee law professor Glenn Reynolds, who consulted on a legal brief for the defendants. "Even if the charges are
bogus, the government proved that they can extort a plea agreement, because any rational [promoter] faced with the threat of going to jail for 25 years is going to
agree to a plea bargain like this that makes it all go away. But it's extortion, not justice."

Within months of the New Orleans indictment, prosecutors in Panama City Beach, Fla., indicted promoters of a popular club called Club La Vela, home to MTV's
Spring Break bootyfests and the nation's largest nightclub, under crack-house laws as well. In Florida, the war against raves was already several years old: In 1997,
state officials passed a bill that made it illegal for clubs or restaurants that sold liquor to stay open past 2 a.m. Two years later, the state police instituted "Operation
Heat Rave," raiding 57 clubs with the intent of shutting them down if they found any evidence of drug use. Club La Vela, the most visible club in Florida, became the
unfortunate locus of the authorities' ire; at one news conference, Panama City Beach Police Chief J.B. Holloway went so far as accusing the club's owners of "raising
[underage patrons] to come back and buy their drugs later."

Club La Vela was raided in early 2000, and police turned up a variety of drugs -- although they found no evidence that the owners themselves were selling illegal
substances. On May 5, 2001, Club La Vela owners Patrick and Thorston Pfeffer were slapped with an indictment for allowing drug trafficking at their club. Like the
New Orleans case, a federal grand jury indicted the nightclub owners under the crack house statute; unlike the New Orleans case, the government also seized the
assets of Club La Vela and forbade the owners from leaving the state of Florida. (Club La Vela's owners, in turn, are suing the local law-enforcement agencies for
defamation and depriving them of their right to public assembly.) The case is set to go to trial in July.

Meanwhile, the crack-house gambit gains momentum in prosecutors' offices across the country. In Chicago, where several clubs have already been shut down after
hosting raves, Mayor Richard M. Daley sought a local twist on the approach, which would mandate six months in jail for anyone who allows drug sales on his or her
property. As Daley said at a press conference in March, "The people who run rave parties -- or own the rooms where they take place -- know exactly what's going
on. But the city does not have sufficient powers to hold them responsible." The ordinance passed in early May.

- - - - - - - - - - - -

There is a strategic logic to the governments' war on glowsticks and pacifiers. For several years, federal drug authorities have been conducting a P.R. campaign that
labels these toys as "drug paraphernalia" that will help identify that drugs are being taken. "What they've done is establish the beginning of a legal paper trail to
substantiate their claims" and make it easier for authorities to target nightclubs, says Will Patterson of EMDEF. "Within a month of the indictment in New Orleans, a
lot of major nightclubs had already stopped selling glowsticks."

But while a few candy ravers might be upset to lose their glowsticks, there's a deadlier side to the new crackdown. A much more dangerous loss to club kids is the
"chill room," which the New Orleans case also identified as an accouterment to drug use in its list of paraphernalia banned from Barbecue Inc.'s parties. A number of
other seemingly innocuous club practices -- like having ambulances present, featuring booths from harm-reduction groups like DanceSafe on the premises or even
pumping in excessive air conditioning -- are being targeted by authorities as well.

The dance-music community is not blind to the fact that drugs are a problem at raves; and as the rave scene has grown, it's also given birth to organizations that
promote responsible clubbing. The most prominent is DanceSafe, a 2-year-old Oakland-based nonprofit founded by theology grad student Emanuel Sferios, which
teaches "harm reduction principles" at clubs. Hundreds of young DanceSafe volunteers, in 24 chapters around the globe, spend their weekends visiting raves and
dispensing information about safe drug consumption. Besides counseling practical party tips -- reminding kids to drink water, chill out and avoid overheating --
volunteers also perform on-the-spot tests of ecstasy tablets, in order to ensure that what the ravers are consuming is actually MDMA rather than a potentially lethal
concoction like DXM or PMA.

The idea is similar to a needle-exchange program: The kids are going to take the pills anyway, so let's make sure that they do it safely. Thus far, DanceSafe has
received support from the local police in the cities where it has chapters. As of yet, no volunteer or raver has been arrested for using the service, thanks to amnesty
arrangements with local police; and according to Sferios, the program has been effective. Although the evidence is still mostly observational, he says, "When people
start to expect us and our presence becomes common, the number of fake pills declines. If you do a particular party every time, or an event location every time, you'll
start to see less fake pills, because the dealers with the fake pills learn they aren't going to get away with it."

DanceSafe's rapidly growing visibility in the rave community has also brought a number of unexpected challenges. According to Sferios, some savvy drug dealers
have learned they can fool the on-site testing kits by putting a tiny amount of MDMA into an otherwise fake pill. (The on-site pill testing kits can determine only
whether a pill contains any ecstasy, not a detailed analysis of its chemical makeup.) "The vast majority of pills with MDMA are still pure," says Sferios, "But we are
seeing ones now that are conscious efforts to fool the kits. It's very disturbing."

Cunning drug dealers, however, are the least of DanceSafe's problems. Although DanceSafe gets plenty of support from local police, the federal government is a
different matter altogether; and DanceSafe is becoming an unintentional victim of the crackdown on nightclubs.

When Eddie Jordan, the New Orleans district attorney, introduced the charges against the Freebass promoters, he cited a list of evidence that the promoters had
been encouraging drug use. That "evidence" included not only glowsticks, bottled water and chill rooms, but the presence of DanceSafe, which distributed literature
at the New Orleans parties and which, according Jordan, was a group that promoted drug use.

DanceSafe has not yet suffered any legal repercussions for its activities, but Jordan's allegations have had a chilling effect on its activities. Promoters are now afraid to
let DanceSafe into their clubs, lest the group's presence -- like that of glowsticks -- be used as evidence against them. "In some cities, promoters that were letting us
into their parties have stopped, because of the New Orleans case," says Sferios, noting several parties in the San Francisco Bay Area where his groups' presence
was prohibited. "The federal emphasis on ecstasy has affected us by frightening promoters into taking irrational and dangerous stances on this issue. Basically, it's the
ostrich syndrome, and it's inhibiting our efforts."

Or, as Patterson describes the dilemma now facing promoters who want to work with DanceSafe: "The government has chosen the rave scene to wage their war
against drugs, and as a promoter I don't know what decision I'd make. On one side you've got young people who want to participate in education about drugs, but
by the very act of engaging in that education process they may be putting the promoter at risk of legal problems."

But DanceSafe's raison d'être is not merely to teach ravers how to be safe, but to teach clubs and promoters to provide safer environments -- what Sferios calls "safe
settings." Much of it is common-sense stuff: Nightclubs and parties should provide free drinking water, chill rooms where overheating dancers can cool off, air
conditioning and, for the largest events, on-duty medics or readily available emergency medical services. Unfortunately, the federal crackdown on nightclubs means
that clubs that do provide these kinds of safety measures are essentially calling attention to themselves as drug havens.

Explains Reynolds, "What has always been regarded as responsible behavior is now going to be regarded as promoters of dangerous behavior. As a result they'll do
things that are dangerous to patrons to protect themselves."

Club La Vela, for example, believes that its diligence in battling drugs was ultimately used as evidence against it. Says Luke Lirot, the attorney representing Thorston
Pfeffer: "Club La Vela had a zero drug-tolerance policy and would call the police anytime they caught anyone with any substance. The police were upset because of
all the calls. But clubs without all those calls of service aren't ferreting out all the drug use. Instead of being critical of this practice, they should have been
commended."

anabolic frolic

Another major nightclub to learn this difficult lesson was Twilo, in New York's Chelsea district, which in 1998 began a long and protracted battle against city
authorities accusing it of being a drug store for kiddie ravers. According to Sferios, Twilo was a perfect example of a "safe settings" nightclub -- it provided ample
water, pumped cool air into its dance floor and even provided a private ambulance in case of drug overdoses or other emergencies. Unfortunately, city authorities
cited that same ambulance as proof that the dance club was a drug den. Although the city's first attempt to remove Twilo's cabaret license was initially rebuffed by an
appeals court as being "arbitrary, capricious and unreasonable," that decision was ultimately overturned by the state's highest court; Twilo is now closed.

"Twilo was probably the safest place in Manhattan -- if something happened, within 30 seconds you would be in the hands of a licensed EMS technician and
paramedic in a full service ambulance," says Mike Bindra, executive producer of Twilo. "The city used that to demonize us.

"We were using the same service the New York Yankees use! Why is it a state law that an ambulance must be present at a football game, or at a Metallica concert
at Madison Square Garden, but when it comes to dance culture and a nightclub you must be using it to smuggle drugs? It's like the Salem witch hunt."

- - - - - - - - - - - -

The list of clubs and promoters that have faced trouble with authorities goes on and on. Also in New York, the Tunnel and Limelight have been fighting similar battles
with city authorities. Rave promoters in San Diego and Humboldt County, Calif., have had their permits yanked. In San Francisco, nightclub institutions like 1015
Folsom and the End Up have battled closure for years. And once the nightclubs shut down, new ones rarely open in their places: Many cities, including New York
and San Francisco, have instituted moratoriums (official and unofficial) on any new cabaret licenses or late-night dance licenses. The net effect is a declining pool of
legal venues for raves, parties, concerts and other dance events.

Some promoters still have hope that if they can get the local authorities on their side, they will avoid federal scrutiny. "I don't think the [crack-house cases] are
affecting me, or anyone else in Southern California, because the people I work with in law enforcement are stellar," says Philip Blaine, owner of KingFish
entertainment in Los Angeles. "Here they have a concern for the public well-being -- they understand that kids will go out at night, and would rather have them going
to a place that's planned and put together, than going under a city bridge and putting on a boombox where if they get hurt no one will find them until Monday, when
their bodies are decaying."

In San Francisco, too, the community is effectively fighting back. In the late 1990s, many of the city's late-night dance clubs -- including the Trocadero, Club DV8
and VSF -- lost their permits, thanks to drug and noise complaints and a zero-tolerance attitude on the part of local officials. In July 1999, a group of local party
promoters organized the San Francisco Late Night Coalition, a political-action committee dedicated to keeping the city's nightlife alive. Thanks to extensive lobbying
and outreach with both nightclub owners and local officials, the group has successfully saved many of the city's remaining dance venues.

These promoters and many others believe that the most naive hope of the federal crackdown on nightclubs is that if you remove the venue, you will remove the
problem. Even if there are no more official places to dance, wave glowsticks and hang out in chill rooms, that doesn't mean that fans of electronic music won't
continue to dance and do drugs. Instead, the electronic music scene will simply go underground to find places to party. Nothing motivates a music subculture more
than the potential to defy authority.

"If they shut down every rave and nightclub and place of public assembly in the country, nothing will happen except that the dangers of drug intake will go
underground, and people who make bad choices will pay the ultimate price," says Lirot, as he battles the Club La Vela case. "Whereas in the alternate settings, smart
people take precautions and deal with problems professionally and safely and in a medically secure fashion. Chasing things underground is never a good idea --
although society thinks they benefit in the short term, they will end up paying for it in the long term."

- - - - - - - - - - - -

About the writer
Janelle Brown is a senior writer for Salon
Technology.

Jess

SEND A LETTER TO THE EDITOR...

http://www.salon.com/about/letters/index.html

__________________
www.neksis.com

DJ smoot

instead of posting and reposting articles, does anyone have a personal opinion?

obviously these laws and trials are unfair

and yes, the people in charge may not realise how this will affect drug use among "ravin' teens"

but seriously, these kinds of things are unavoidable, and there is not a thing any single person can do about it

we can write letters, we can protest, we can go on a hunger strike, but what comes out of this would be many pissed off parents, many pissed off kids, and involvement of the law...

and yes its scary, absence of parties will in turn put djs out of a "job" and when they stop bying records, producers will be left with a lot of useless equipment and vinyl.

i guess my point is that, before any of these laws will come into effect here, there would first have to be organised parties, and venues, and good promoters, and instead of concentrating on whining about how unfair this is (in another country in some of your cases), people should put their efforts into succeeding at throwing a respectable event first....and then worrying about whether it is going to be affected by some law, and shut down

this would be more effective posted elsewhere.....

elena mistress of opinion

ProdigyBoy

hymmm i havent done all my reading on the crack house laws and how it's efffects yet.

but there are ways to combat it.

put the glowstick in hands of ppl they would never arrest. ie all the kids at Back Street Boy concert or all the ppl watching fireworks on Independance Day. that makes a statement on how there amusement is for parties not just drugs.

the dust/air/gas masks are not for drug use but to avoid smoke and dust. it's not a bad things

pacifiers, well those do have a stronger relation to drugs. will not allowing ppl to have them discourage drug use? i don't think it will but leave ppl with bleeding mouths and high dental bills.

it's not hard to compare a rave to a glorified crack house. the fairly open environment, sounds, lights, and friendly ppl on and of them. some parties have medical staff to make it safer and you have an entire night to enjoy it.
difference is that you got to pay for all those things. so a good rave gives you enough things to enjoy for the costs and thats being sober. doing drugs will make u feel good but going to a rave with it just increases your cost and is a waste of money in my mind. do one or the other but why both.

newhoo that's a bit of topic. fight drugs like you do everywhere else. search for it, narcs, but not by taking away rights.

later,
Cameron Bay.

Commander Keen

Shrug, personally, I think we should examine 2 issues about the crack downs.
1) what are the motives behind the crack downs and
2) what can be done to reduce drugs/drug overdoses and other injuries related tod rugs..

issue 1, the motive behind the crack downs. As stated in the article, billions and billions have been spent by the US federal government ont he just say no to drugs campaign and I believe that it is accurate in saying that the campaign has been a huge flop. As a result, the government needs a very public enemy to attack to show the public that they are actually doing something to combat drugs.

Question, what is more imporatant, actually doing something effective, or looking good in the public's eye.

My opinion is that the just say no campaign should be scraped and a harm reduction stratigy should be employed in its place.
In Europe, drug use is treated as a social problem and not a criminal. Education is key in reducing the deaths associated with drugs.

issue 2) what can be done. REplacing the just say no policy with ahrm reduction.. This involves law enforcement agencies at all levels working with promoters and club owners, rather than against them. I do believe that having ambulance workers at large events is not only wise, but required. Again, as stated in the original article, ambulance workers are required to be present at sporting events and concerts, why not at parties where attendence can reach as high as in the tens of thousands.
Dancesafe is an effective group where the local law enforcement agencies work woth the group and not against them. But this requires a change in the motive of the agencies from just say no to harm reduction.

We all know people will do drugs, its been around for centuries, appempting to eliminate drugs is an unrealistic goal. As long as the demand is there, the drugs will keep on showing up.

perhaps regulation of these so called designer drugs could help.
As bizzare as it sounds, one central drug source like the hell's angels in ottawa might actually make the drug scene safer. By having one source regulaing the drug flow, even if it it illigitimate has many benefits, one of which is quality control. If there are only a few types of drugs to use, the providers will want to make sure that it is of good quality. It's simple economics..

Society needs to get past these moral issues about drugs and otehr issues and start working on real solutions..

and thats my $0.02

Commander Keen

Oh ya

Glowsticks as drug paraphenalia is total BS...

Again, if the law enforcement agencies would work closer within the scene, like having a liason with the community, maybe the agencies and the politicians would have a better understanding of how our culture really works, and would come up with more effective laws.

heaven forbid that people would want to dance with glowsticks in hand.... it's not like it looks nice or anything..

And the chillout room, well the kids are already high on drugs... they don't need to rest after dancing for hours on end...

DJ smoot

you have some very valid opinions Mr. keen

the way i see it, is that there are two halfs to our side.

one being that people who enjoy taking drugs, have this "im gonna take drugs at parties and you cant stop me" attitude

these are the people who are too stubborn to see that they should stay at home and take their drugs there, instead of taking them at a party and ending everything for the other half

the other half are people like me, who dont care for the drugs, but are powerless to prevent this whole "war against drugs" policy.

so in a way, we are only hurting each other.

the only way that we can save anything from being "shut down" is to realise that while it is ok for people to take drugs (because they will anyway) it is NOT ok for them to bring drugs into the public, and show off in front of everyone. if there was a total stop to all drug related issues at parties, we would not have to worry about laws like the "crack house law"....think about it

elena

Commander Keen

^^
agreed.... drugs are currently illegal, and should be treated as such... Although we may disagree with the laws, they are still the law. If one is going to take drugs at a party they should at least have the common sense to use some discretion. As much as pacifiers are cute an all (I personally don't have a problem with them) one cannot deny the fact that they are an indicator of drug use in the area..

Respect others, and respect the scene. Please don't talk about drug use at parties.. or at least don't advertise how high you are. We don't need to add more wood to the fire so to speak.
And if you do use drugs at parties, please do them responsibily. Know your limits, don't push yourself to the brink of exhaustion and drink lots of water.

Question about the promoters who got arrested... were they doing searches at the parties?? if so, how can the law enforcement agencies say that the promoters are providing a crack house when it is obvious that searches at parties are meant to keep weapons and illegal substances out?
One cannot both provide a place to do drugs and at the same time keep drugs out..

DJ smoot

thing about searches at the door is that usually its very hard to find pills

people have ways of sneaking things in that are not going to be found unless the person is stipped naked and probed

and i think that most searches are mostly for weapons and such "big" things that are easily found inside loose clothing.

and even some bags and articles of clothing have "secret" pockets that are not going to be checked.

either way, it is up to the people coming to the party to use their brains and decide between right and wrong

elena

monstercan-D

Respect others, and respect the scene. Please don't talk about drug use at parties.. or at least don't advertise how high you are. We don't need to add more wood to the fire so to speak.
And if you do use drugs at parties, please do them responsibily. Know your limits, don't push yourself to the brink of exhaustion and drink lots of water.


I have seen too many people snorting stuff out in the open; doing drugs does not automatically make you cool!

Commander Keen

Agreed, searches are unlikely to stop the pills from getting in, at least for personal use....
searches are motly for weapons and large bulky drugs.... but still it is a deterrant....
again, its up to the person.. I figure, it you're stupid enough to get busted, you're probably deserve it... if you were smart enough to hide it and to not advertise yer drug use, you probably won't get caught..

the promoters can't stop all the drugs from getting in.. they are doing the best they can..
whatelse can the promoter do besides minimize the harm/damage?

Roches

47 from ketamine?

i don't think so.

those statistics should not be stated as "died from"; they actually mean that the person had the drug in their system at the time of death. they hide the fact that no one has ever died from ketamine alone-- it would be like saying that 1,200 people died from weed, when in fact they just had weed in their system when they died from a heroin overdose, or opiates + alcohol, or something like that.


i'm disgusted by the concept that a citizen in an ostensibly free society would be forbidden from possessing a GLOWSTICK.

i have some forbidden objects myself-two 50 mL Erlenmeyer flasks, which are illegal in Texas.

that's even worse; it's a piece of glass. it's no more "drug paraphernalia" than a spoon, a belt or a cotton ball.

stuff like this should really make people think about the motive and the mechanism of the war on drugs. it's easy enough to question whether some of these things--asset forfeiture, for example--are justified or even legal themselves. question the fundamental concept-that these things are okay because drugs are bad and must be stopped-and you arrive at the inevitable conclusion that a war on drugs is ridiculous and unwinnable.

drug abuse is a public health issue, not a legal issue.

every time the media and government tells of the horror of crack houses, crack babies, roving drug gangs with automatic weapons, rapidly increasing drug abuse rates, the fatal perils of ecstacy or the use of ghb as a date rape drug, the situation is the same: they burn down the reichstag and ask for new powers to combat the pernicious threat.

tired as it may be, one quote really sums up the issue perfectly:
"Oceania is at war with Eurasia. Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia."
the analogy is perfect; the war on drugs is an artificial and unwinnable war invented to justify excessive expenditures and gross violations of civil rights. the world's impotent bureaucracies use the war on drugs and other invented non-issues as distractions from the real threats. when was the last time an election was fought over poverty or racial discrimination? not recently; both parties agree that the poor should remain poor, the rich should grow richer, and anyone who isn't a white, heterosexual, Christian male isn't entitled to the same standard of living as those who are. so they argue over minor non-issues like raves, abortion and gay rights, offer the masses a tax cut ("the chocolate ration has been increased to fourteen grams!"-1984 again) and take turns on the throne. in a country where hundreds of thousands of person-years of suffering could be undone with one supreme court decision, where the ruining of an otherwise innocuous marijuana-possessor's life could be prevented by the opposition of one juror (that's one of the cool parts about the jury system; you're allowed to vote "not guilty" in spite of the evidence if you believe the law is unjust), the americans should expect a lot more freedom than they get.

fireflygodess

"Respect others, and respect the scene. Please don't talk about drug use at parties.. or at least don't advertise how high you are. We don't need to add more wood to the fire so to speak.
And if you do use drugs at parties, please do them responsibily. Know your limits, don't push yourself to the brink of exhaustion and drink lots of water. "

I had just gotten through saying the same thing to someone just a few minutes ago. I think that there are a lot of people who share this idea, but sadly a lot of the kids coming into the scene don't have the kind of insight it requires to see it this way. I think it's a part of the growing up process. Once you have been around enough you learn what to do and what not to do, which is the reason that we older partiers should make it a point to tell our yougins about the consequences of their actions. I do not mean that we should tell them how they should be, just show them by example. I have an idealistic notion that a good example carries a lot more weight than a bunch of words that go in through one ear and go out through the other.

Firefly

__________________
An Idle mind is the devil's workshop. Stay out of hell

fireflygodess

Just in case you guys had not heard yet, we have one good reason to celebrate. I'm sure the authorities will find some other law to bend and twist at their will so they can attack the scene, but I must say this news really felt good to read.

Firefly


DEA RAVE BUST GOES BUST

Charges Against New Orleans Club Promoters Dropped

In a major victory for club promoters and ravegoers, a U.S. attorney in New Orleans has dropped most of the charges against promoters at the State Palace Theatre, home of the city's largest raves. The defendants had been accused of encouraging and assisting drug use. "This is an admission that the government shouldn't have been barking up this tree," says Arthur Lemman, attorney for Brian Brunet, one of the promoters.

The decision -a plea agreement between the U.S. attorney's office and the defendants -- brings to an end a controversial six-month case in which U.S. Attorney Eddie Jordan ( who left office in April ) charged the three promoters - Brunet, his brother Robert and Donnie Estopinal -with violation of the 1986 federal "crack-house statute." That law calls for jail time of up to twenty years, fines of up to $500,000 and property seizures against defendants convicted of operating a home or establishment with the intent of illegal drug use. The State Palace Theatre, which often packs in 3,000 rovers a night, had been under Drug Enforcement Administration scrutiny since the 1998 overdose death of a seventeen-year-old Alabama woman, which authorities linked to the use of Ecstasy.

Full article:
www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v...4.html?397